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1. dliup

   Fresh-Faced Recruit

   Joined: Jan 2006

   +12
   11/30, 05:05pm | report spam | close reply

   Microsoft security

   How do you secure windows? Disable it! That's the Microsoft way.

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1. testudo

   Forum Regular

   Joined: Aug 2001

   -17
   11/30, 06:03pm | report spam | close reply

   Oh right....

   Prevx has developed a fix for affected computers and says the issue likely stems from changes to the Access Control List, which governs the exact permissions each app has on a system. Certain apps don't recognize the changes and as a result conflict with Windows.
   
   So the ACL was changed, and certain apps don't recognize the change? Sounds more like a problem with the apps than with Windows. Are they accessing the ACLs correctly? Are they checking for changes they shouldn't be? Oh, no, actually it occurs because programs try to change keys in the registry without checking permissions. So let's not blame the lazy programmers lacking the error handling. Let's blame windows (who might be locking down the keys for a good reason, who knows).
   
   And what exactly is the problem or the 'fix' they tell you to download? They don't say. They just say "Download it! It'll fix your issue!" (which it might. Or it might be a trojan backdoor to hack into your system later).
   
   Oh, and reading their 'blog' posting, the guy writes:
   
   If you Google "Black Screen" then you will find a whopping 80Million plus results, mostly dominated by people searching for a fix to this problem.
   
   Really. And did they go through all 80 million to see? Because I seriously doubt that most (as in 50%+) are all about black screens of death in windows.

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1. nat

   Junior Member

   Joined: Mar 2002

   +11
   11/30, 07:18pm | report spam | close reply

   oh testudo

   so apps are working find, ms changes the acl and suddenly they don't work. how in the hail are they going to recognize the change if MS changed them with the patch? you think they're dynamic or something? what a stupid argument.
   
   if the guy took a sampling and found them to be predominantly about the black screen then why should he go through all 80 million? you've heard of statistics, no?

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1. testudo

   Forum Regular

   Joined: Aug 2001

   -14
   11/30, 08:02pm | report spam | close reply

   oh nat

   so apps are working find, ms changes the acl and suddenly they don't work. how in the hail are they going to recognize the change if MS changed them with the patch? you think they're dynamic or something? what a stupid argument.
   
   No, that's a stupid argument. Based on that theory, if Apple changes the permission on a directory in an update, and someone's software was writing to that directory and now can't, it is apple's fault, not the software, because Apple originally allowed you to write to that folder. No, you'd expect them to check that the directory is writable before making changes.
   
   The fact is you have no idea what the problem or the change was anymore than I do. But you also don't know whether the change was valid.
   
   For all we know, the changes were made so these changes to those registry keys could only be made by going through the system APIs, closing some security loophole. And, of course, the software vendors are going to be the ones complaining they can't do what they used to do.
   
   But let's not question those Windows developers, even though we all know they all take shortcuts and are crappy programmers. Let's blame MS for not supporting 100% backwards compatibilty.
   
   if the guy took a sampling and found them to be predominantly about the black screen then why should he go through all 80 million? you've heard of statistics, no?
   
   I've heard of statistics. As such, I know that looking at 20 items out of 80 million is not a statistical sample.
   
   Plus, have you ever used google? Try it. Go past two pages, and you'll see how the results you start getting are all over the map.
   
   And do you really think there's 40 million pages out there devoted to this issue? I doubt you ever even heard of it before you got here.

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1. nat

   Junior Member

   Joined: Mar 2002

   +8
   11/30, 08:31pm | report spam | close reply

   oh testudo

   "The fact is you have no idea what the problem or the change was anymore than I do."
   finally, some truth from you. it has taken years but you've managed it! well done.
   
   uh, oops...
   
   "even though we all know they all take shortcuts and are crappy programmers. Let's blame MS for not supporting 100% backwards compatibilty."
   
   So, ALL programmers for windows are crappy. And, on top of being crappy they ALL take shortcuts.
   Since the backwards compatibility issue is based on your assumption that it was closing security holes how can you possibly conclude that we're blaming MS for not supporting it as though it's a fact? It's your assumption so your conclusion is factual. Ok pumpkin.
   
   So, the guy looked at 20 items? 20 exactly. No more, no less. 20. Again, your assumption. Your conclusion? "As such, I know that looking at 20 items out of 80 million is not a statistical sample."
   Another fact?
   Ok pumpkin.
   
   
   
   

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1. chas_m

   Moderator
   

   Joined: Aug 2001

   +3
   11/30, 09:19pm | report spam | close reply

   BWAHAHAHAHAHA

   HAHAHAHAHAHA (breathes in) BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA (etc)

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1. Foe Hammer

   Fresh-Faced Recruit

   Joined: Feb 2005

   +5
   11/30, 09:39pm | report spam | close reply

   MS Finally Does Colors in Windows!

   Black and Blue ... how multi-fitting.

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1. gskibum3

   Fresh-Faced Recruit

   Joined: Nov 2006

   -2
   11/30, 11:28pm | report spam | close reply

   Huh

   Next we'll be going to news sites about the Windows OS to read about bugs in OS X.

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1. IxOsX

   Fresh-Faced Recruit

   Joined: Feb 2009

   +2
   12/01, 02:07am | report spam | (1 reply) close | reply

   Windows

   Typical window... Tradition first! :) Every OS have flaws but none have as much as windows have. But that is just my 20 years of experience dealling with Microsoft lousy OS. I just thanks for exist alternatives like OSX, Linux and Unix!!! But Windows cheeps fan legions are huge, so does not matter wich OS is better.

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1. LouZer

   Fresh-Faced Recruit

   Joined: Nov 2000

   -7
   12/01, 09:28am | report spam | close reply

   And yet

   If the same thing happened on os x, you all would be railing against the developer and saying apple did nothing wrong.
   
   Oh, and note how they said they were going to contact ms. You'd think they would have done this first.
   
   And who actually has heard of thus company?

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1. testudo

   Forum Regular

   Joined: Aug 2001

   -2
   12/01, 10:03am | report spam | close reply

   oh nat

   I just love how, when you don't have anything substantive to say, you just go into your "Oh, I'll talk to them like a child, because then I'll feel superior tone."
   
   So, ALL programmers for windows are crappy. And, on top of being crappy they ALL take shortcuts. Since the backwards compatibility issue is based on your assumption that it was closing security holes how can you possibly conclude that we're blaming MS for not supporting it as though it's a fact? It's your assumption so your conclusion is factual. Ok pumpkin.
   
   I didn't say all windows programmers are crappy. I leave that to the fanboys here, like yourself, who have no respect for anyone who doesn't drink Steve Jobs' kool-aid. However, everyone here claims the reason Windows is such a security black hole is all that backwards compatibility they insist on. (Yeah, how dare they listen to their customers complaints about not wanting to spend millions of dollars upgrading software and hardware at MS's whims!). And the main issue with backward compatibility is usually closing the loopholes and plugging the apis that people use and aren't supposed to. (Do we need to go back and discuss 32-bit compatibility mode in OS 6?).
   
   So, the guy looked at 20 items? 20 exactly. No more, no less. 20. Again, your assumption. Your conclusion? "As such, I know that looking at 20 items out of 80 million is not a statistical sample."
   Another fact?
   Ok pumpkin.
   
   Oh, you are correct on that. I am sure they wrote a sophisticated algorithmic analysis tool that scanned a statistically relevant set of pages and validated they all referred to this issue, and not any other issue involving black screens, or screen black, or anything else. You got me there. Sure, you could just google this up yourself and notice barely any results that come up refer to this problem, but why should we quibble over things like this.
   

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1. testudo

   Forum Regular

   Joined: Aug 2001

   +1
   12/01, 10:10am | report spam | close reply

   And one more thing

   I think this story just proves the control Microsoft has on the world today.
   
   For, if you look or listen, they've apparently have forced all those liberal news media from reporting this story. What, with all these Windows 7 machines crashing and burning, you'd think it would be all over the place. But, no, MS has paid them to be quiet.
   
   And one wonders the kick-backs going to the likes of Symantec and McAfee. As they don't even mention this issue on their websites. I guess they're just happy MS keeps them in business, so they don't want to do anything to disparage the OS maker.
   
   Oh, but I did see a story on CNet.uk. Of course, it just referenced a story on Cnet.com. Which just referenced the same blog posting from the same company that MacNN is referencing. I guess Cnet can't be bought, at least.
   
   Or it could be that it is this one company's product which has this 'problem', and they're trying to make it sound like it isn't their fault, it's Microsoft's issue. (So much so that they haven't reported it to them yet?).
   
   Yeah, but who wants to hear that, when you can print headlines about a widespread issue that affects millions of computer users around the world! I think we should all head out to Best Buy today and just watch the lines of people at the Geek Squad counters trying to get their new computers to work...

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1. nat

   Junior Member

   Joined: Mar 2002

   +4
   12/01, 11:13am | report spam | close reply

   oh louzer

   do you kids never tire of the same old argument? you're like testudo junior, same feeble arguments ad nauseam. can you at least come up with your own every so often just to give it a fresh look? no?

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1. nat

   Junior Member

   Joined: Mar 2002

   +3
   12/01, 11:20am | report spam | close reply

   oh testudo

   uh... what?
   
   "even though we all know they all take shortcuts and are crappy programmers."
   
   you didn't say that? really? call the police because someone is posing as you and using your name.
   
   "everyone here claims the reason Windows is such a security black hole is all that backwards compatibility they insist on"
   
   really? dear me. i think everyone here realizes that it's far more involved than that, but hey, if that's what gets you out of bed in the morning.
   
   the rest, well, geesh, i'm not going to respond to every little wrong you've taken the time to write. you're monologueing is annoying enough without me having to go through the whole dang thing.
   
   go get some rest. you need it.

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1. Foe Hammer

   Fresh-Faced Recruit

   Joined: Feb 2005

   +1
   12/01, 12:25pm | report spam | close reply

   And Yet Again ...

   Don't be so sure about us saying that Apple did nothing wrong if such a thing happened on OS X.
   
   But regarding Prexv saying they were going to contact MS first, I'd bet they did ... and MS promptly told them that it wasn't their problem and that they'd have to contact the people at Prevx about it. (At least MS graciously gave them their own number.) :-)
   

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1. testudo

   Forum Regular

   Joined: Aug 2001

   +2
   12/01, 02:12pm | report spam | close reply

   Re: And yet again

   I find it hillarious the group of people who read one story and believe it, because it is against Microsoft.
   
   The so-called deadly security patch was released in early November. This blog post went up in late November. The patch is still posted and has not been taken down. No one else seems to be reporting about this issue, nor is there really a load of web sites with people complaining about the issue (despite their claims).